For better or worse I’m prone to give a new take on single words, names or common phrases while trying to give a novel way for thinking about them. It’s a form of entertaining myself at least and hopefully a few others from time to time at best. You either “get it” or you don’t. Many things are like that: one man’s treasure is another man’s junk and versa vice. (That last one was thrown in as another goofy example of trying to make the ordinary more interesting. You either like such things or you don’t. Picasso didn’t strive to… Read more »
daskoterzar
6 months ago
852 school districts in Illinois. Half have 2 buildings or less. But they all need a superintendent, principals, vice principals, office staff, offices, facilities, meetings, lunches, etc. It is and has always been a complete waste of money. Illinois needs to consolidate the districts and get rid of hundreds of millions of dollars or overhead. Pathetic.
I don’t know the truth of your story here, but the financial side of it typically is far less exciting in such cases as you want to portray. My grandfather eons ago was a school superintendent in the state of Washington, and his tales as an elder tended to use that title. But, the reality was much as your story portrays— minus the big bucks assumption. As time progressed in my life I pondered his life there and learned he not only was the school superintendent; he also one of a handful of its teachers and essentially the school custodian… Read more »
When your Grandfather was participating, it was certainly at a time when people had integrity and commitment, I am not sure those wonderful traits exist in today’s education business. In those roles, a person such as your grandfather was likely very visible, remembered by many and appreciated/loved for his relationship with students/parents, his work and commitment. But ya know, James as you say this, there currently is a large list of superintendents, principals and teachers on the salary and pension lists in the state of Illinois who are paid $200K+. Some are ridiculously paid even more – the highest is… Read more »
Sure, I can agree with you on all of that. But, where are probably 90+% of those super-sized superintendent salaries to be found? I’d bet a wad that it’s Chicago and its suburbs out to maybe 35-50 miles in most any direction. Beyond that you’ll find lots of such jobs but for way, way less moolah with the exception of the larger cities most likely. You want to portray such salaries as essentially happening throughout the state. I’m saying it’s more a matter of where such people live and the socioeconomic environment there. In general places where salaries and economic… Read more »
And that is what we call anecdotal evidence. Do some research of superintendent salaries in the suburbs. Look up the smaller districts in the collar counties and see if there are situations to consolidate high school and elementary school districts. Look for the towns that have 4-5 school districts in their borders. There is a lot of waste. One of the problems though with any type of consolidation is that the taxpayers will not really see any relief because the mentality will to “put more money in the classrooms” which will not produce any significant improvements in the education of… Read more »
Rarely? Have you never seen the chart provided on this site showing the obscene pensions/ salaries of IL school administrators? Do you think IL is an anomaly? I’m willing to bet it’s as bad ( if not worse ) in CA, NJ, NY and other states.
Make that the larger urban/suburban school district superintendents, and it’ll carry more weight with me. The less populated and the poorer areas aren’t the culprits in similar percentage terms. Still, there will be the outliers, of course.
Leaving Soon, just not soon enough
6 months ago
The pay is high, but the pension payouts are far higher. Most get well over $100,000 per year and many get $200,000 per year and some even more. They also get the for over 30 plus years with 3% annual increases. They are laughing all the way to the bank, many in Florida living the high life. Home – Illinois Public Pensions Database
Last edited 6 months ago by Leaving Soon, just not soon enough
mqyl
6 months ago
There should never be only one public high school under one superintendent in Illinois. That’s taxpayer abuse. In such a scenario, that district should be consolidated. There’s no need to waste taxpayer money on a study to make that determination.
The guy in the article says consolidation would be “under one larger superintendent salary.” Yes, as we all know, it’s unreasonable to ask a superintendent making only $400K to oversee two high schools.
You seem maybe unaware that many IL high schools are part of a unit district where multiple elementary schools also have the same superintendent. I’m not necessarily opposed to your idea and even like it theoretically, but it’s my impression you think some superintendents oversee only one high school and no elementary school(s). There may be a few cases, but I’m not aware of any at all.
Well, truly I am surprised. I’m taking you at face value here that these are all high school (only) districts. If so, without knowing the details of each such district it seems a scam to me as well that one person can’t act as both the superintendent and building principal. But, again, there may be more time commitments than is reasonable for one person to do reasonably efficiently and well. Never been there and done that!
So how to fix it James? You would need to consolidate these districts with other districts. But who? For most of these districts, they could consolidate with their K-8 feeder districts and become unit districts. Now for most of these districts, the high school contract has higher pay than most K-8 contracts for all of those teachers. If these districts were to combine, which pay scale do you think would end up as the prevailing contract? That’s right, it would be the higher pay scale and better benefits package. So sure, people can combine districts and potentially lower the administration… Read more »
I’ve been busy. FYI, I signed Ted’s petition to get on the ballot at the Bears game against the Saints. You had some high quality young people collecting signatures in the Waldron Parking Deck. It’s good to see more young people supporting the Republican Party.
You’ve said it well enough in that you’ve identified the usual outcomes. Then, you might add that most people simply don’t like change, preferring “the devil you know” to the unknown.
They are defintely one high school only districts. These are the ones that I know of. I am sure there are more. That being said, these districts have enrollments that range from 700-4000+. There can be arguments made to consolidate districts with other high schools and/or elementary districts. Each consolidation would have its own issues such as HS teachers making more than elementary teachers or neighboring HS districts. Also, Elementary, HS and Unit districts have different rates that they can levy which further complicates issues.
Please see my answer to PPF in that your remarks are so similar. His last paragraph might have possibilities, but almost literally nobody wants more governmental decisions made by distantc“foreigners,” preferring locals to make the calls.
taxpayer
6 months ago
The article quotes an “expert” as saying “consolidation and deconsolidation are often just maneuvers used to shift problems that are growing or already present in a district.”
IPI does link to a study showing a statistical relationship between larger district size, lower expenditure, and better student achievement. That implies that Chicago Public Schools would be the best in the State.
I wonder if anyone has been able to analyze the actual experience of actual consolidations.
Your dime, your dance floor
6 months ago
It’s not only the superintendent’s salary you save but the entire district office’s salaries you eliminate through consolidation. In the Rich Township example there are 27 other employees in the district office. The receptionist, according to a gov salaries website, makes 65k. An assistant superintendent makes just under 200k. Eliminating this entire staff probably saves $3.5 – $4.0 million in annual salary. Down the road this also saves millions of dollars in pension payouts. In Florida, with a population of about 22 million people, there are 67 school districts. One per county. If Illinois followed this model we would have… Read more »
Chaos In My Brain
6 months ago
4 school superintendents all feeding to one high school district with one HS and a superintendent. Two elementary schools with a superintendent, 1 elementary school with a superintendent. 4 elementary schools with a superintendent. Another 4 elementary school district with a superintendent. Add in the office stsff, asst superintendent and there’s millions of wasted tax money meant for schools. Remember, it’s about the children……..now that’s funny
A largely unasked question is becoming glaring: Is Illinois doing all it should to use artificial intelligence to make government cost less and work better? So far, the evidence says no.
For better or worse I’m prone to give a new take on single words, names or common phrases while trying to give a novel way for thinking about them. It’s a form of entertaining myself at least and hopefully a few others from time to time at best. You either “get it” or you don’t. Many things are like that: one man’s treasure is another man’s junk and versa vice. (That last one was thrown in as another goofy example of trying to make the ordinary more interesting. You either like such things or you don’t. Picasso didn’t strive to… Read more »
852 school districts in Illinois. Half have 2 buildings or less. But they all need a superintendent, principals, vice principals, office staff, offices, facilities, meetings, lunches, etc. It is and has always been a complete waste of money. Illinois needs to consolidate the districts and get rid of hundreds of millions of dollars or overhead. Pathetic.
I don’t know the truth of your story here, but the financial side of it typically is far less exciting in such cases as you want to portray. My grandfather eons ago was a school superintendent in the state of Washington, and his tales as an elder tended to use that title. But, the reality was much as your story portrays— minus the big bucks assumption. As time progressed in my life I pondered his life there and learned he not only was the school superintendent; he also one of a handful of its teachers and essentially the school custodian… Read more »
When your Grandfather was participating, it was certainly at a time when people had integrity and commitment, I am not sure those wonderful traits exist in today’s education business. In those roles, a person such as your grandfather was likely very visible, remembered by many and appreciated/loved for his relationship with students/parents, his work and commitment. But ya know, James as you say this, there currently is a large list of superintendents, principals and teachers on the salary and pension lists in the state of Illinois who are paid $200K+. Some are ridiculously paid even more – the highest is… Read more »
Sure, I can agree with you on all of that. But, where are probably 90+% of those super-sized superintendent salaries to be found? I’d bet a wad that it’s Chicago and its suburbs out to maybe 35-50 miles in most any direction. Beyond that you’ll find lots of such jobs but for way, way less moolah with the exception of the larger cities most likely. You want to portray such salaries as essentially happening throughout the state. I’m saying it’s more a matter of where such people live and the socioeconomic environment there. In general places where salaries and economic… Read more »
And that is what we call anecdotal evidence. Do some research of superintendent salaries in the suburbs. Look up the smaller districts in the collar counties and see if there are situations to consolidate high school and elementary school districts. Look for the towns that have 4-5 school districts in their borders. There is a lot of waste. One of the problems though with any type of consolidation is that the taxpayers will not really see any relief because the mentality will to “put more money in the classrooms” which will not produce any significant improvements in the education of… Read more »
Thanks for the input, Mr. Paine in the Rs.
That was almost funny but let’s go with the sentiment that, indeed, schools should be focusing on the 3 Rs.
Those were the Rs I had in mind, of course. You thought otherwise?
It seemed like a combination of the 3 Rs and a play on the word aRse. Just having a little fun back.
Rarely? Have you never seen the chart provided on this site showing the obscene pensions/ salaries of IL school administrators? Do you think IL is an anomaly? I’m willing to bet it’s as bad ( if not worse ) in CA, NJ, NY and other states.
Make that the larger urban/suburban school district superintendents, and it’ll carry more weight with me. The less populated and the poorer areas aren’t the culprits in similar percentage terms. Still, there will be the outliers, of course.
The pay is high, but the pension payouts are far higher. Most get well over $100,000 per year and many get $200,000 per year and some even more. They also get the for over 30 plus years with 3% annual increases. They are laughing all the way to the bank, many in Florida living the high life.
Home – Illinois Public Pensions Database
There should never be only one public high school under one superintendent in Illinois. That’s taxpayer abuse. In such a scenario, that district should be consolidated. There’s no need to waste taxpayer money on a study to make that determination.
The guy in the article says consolidation would be “under one larger superintendent salary.” Yes, as we all know, it’s unreasonable to ask a superintendent making only $400K to oversee two high schools.
You seem maybe unaware that many IL high schools are part of a unit district where multiple elementary schools also have the same superintendent. I’m not necessarily opposed to your idea and even like it theoretically, but it’s my impression you think some superintendents oversee only one high school and no elementary school(s). There may be a few cases, but I’m not aware of any at all.
Here are high school districts that have only one high school in their district:
Stevenson
New Trier
Reavis
Oak Lawn
Evergreen Park
Lemont
Lyons Township
Lockport
Minooka
Pontiac
Morris
Bradley Boubonnais
Well, truly I am surprised. I’m taking you at face value here that these are all high school (only) districts. If so, without knowing the details of each such district it seems a scam to me as well that one person can’t act as both the superintendent and building principal. But, again, there may be more time commitments than is reasonable for one person to do reasonably efficiently and well. Never been there and done that!
So how to fix it James? You would need to consolidate these districts with other districts. But who? For most of these districts, they could consolidate with their K-8 feeder districts and become unit districts. Now for most of these districts, the high school contract has higher pay than most K-8 contracts for all of those teachers. If these districts were to combine, which pay scale do you think would end up as the prevailing contract? That’s right, it would be the higher pay scale and better benefits package. So sure, people can combine districts and potentially lower the administration… Read more »
PPF, you’re back. You were gone for awhile. We were worried about you. (Yes, honestly.)
I’ve been busy. FYI, I signed Ted’s petition to get on the ballot at the Bears game against the Saints. You had some high quality young people collecting signatures in the Waldron Parking Deck. It’s good to see more young people supporting the Republican Party.
You’ve said it well enough in that you’ve identified the usual outcomes. Then, you might add that most people simply don’t like change, preferring “the devil you know” to the unknown.
Sounds like you are describing the impenetrable strait jacket of public unions.
It’s quite an achievement.
They are defintely one high school only districts. These are the ones that I know of. I am sure there are more. That being said, these districts have enrollments that range from 700-4000+. There can be arguments made to consolidate districts with other high schools and/or elementary districts. Each consolidation would have its own issues such as HS teachers making more than elementary teachers or neighboring HS districts. Also, Elementary, HS and Unit districts have different rates that they can levy which further complicates issues.
Please see my answer to PPF in that your remarks are so similar. His last paragraph might have possibilities, but almost literally nobody wants more governmental decisions made by distantc“foreigners,” preferring locals to make the calls.
The article quotes an “expert” as saying “consolidation and deconsolidation are often just maneuvers used to shift problems that are growing or already present in a district.”
IPI does link to a study showing a statistical relationship between larger district size, lower expenditure, and better student achievement. That implies that Chicago Public Schools would be the best in the State.
I wonder if anyone has been able to analyze the actual experience of actual consolidations.
It’s not only the superintendent’s salary you save but the entire district office’s salaries you eliminate through consolidation. In the Rich Township example there are 27 other employees in the district office. The receptionist, according to a gov salaries website, makes 65k. An assistant superintendent makes just under 200k. Eliminating this entire staff probably saves $3.5 – $4.0 million in annual salary. Down the road this also saves millions of dollars in pension payouts. In Florida, with a population of about 22 million people, there are 67 school districts. One per county. If Illinois followed this model we would have… Read more »
4 school superintendents all feeding to one high school district with one HS and a superintendent. Two elementary schools with a superintendent, 1 elementary school with a superintendent. 4 elementary schools with a superintendent. Another 4 elementary school district with a superintendent. Add in the office stsff, asst superintendent and there’s millions of wasted tax money meant for schools. Remember, it’s about the children……..now that’s funny