I continue to read with interest all the different viewpoints on a very serious topic. i have made my decision that the taxes will continue and for my situation I have now embarked on this path.I am in the process of closing my business, A corporation that has been open for 38 years. The employees are now gone, office closing, waiting for filling of final tax docs. it does not pay as this state does not care what happens to businesses. I am done paying excessive taxes, FUTA and regulations taxes. I am closing corporate bank and checking accounts opening… Read more »
Best decision you have ever made for yourself and your family. Tens of thousands of people are head of you and even more will follow you. Best of luck.
David F
5 months ago
Illinois need to place a 10% service charge on all pensions paid to people not living in Illinois.
Gee, we haven’t seen that no-go proposal for maybe 3-4 days. You are not a frequent reader here apparently. “Service charges” will be considered the same in their effect as taxes and given that name essentially as a ruse for it no matter whether applied to all IL public employee pensioners or selective subsets, clearly are not allowable by the “pension clause” of the 1970 IL constitution. Now, if you clearly intend it to apply to literally every IL pensioner you may have a winning strategy, although that service charge you want is still a tax by another name.
Once someone moves out of state you can’t tax their pensions regardless if it’s public or private. David’s illegal solution that he post here every couple of days would violate federal law. His low intellect plays well with many here but offers no real world solution.
Legislate with teeth to stop COLA until a system is 90% funded and freeze salaries until pension contributions equal 25% of payroll. Pritzker suspended numerous contractual provisions during COVID via emergency decrees. Rating agencies and creditors should insist on something like this as conditions for marketable ratings or future loans or refraining from default and collection efforts. Object: force municipal bankruptcies.
Good luck explaining that to the current public union workers who expect to be treated like their forebears collecting inflated pensions based on ridiculous salaries.
Do you want to explain that they can’t have increases because the money must be used to pay retirees? I’m sure they will understand.
That’s adorable that you think future spending fights will be between current unions employees and retirees. I’m sure in order to pay pensions Illinois will cut spending for union employees. lol. Seriously, you should be writing comedy.
You seem to be saying that both actives and retirees will have all of their expectations met. But maybe you are saying that if funds are insufficient then pensions must be paid first. If it’s the latter, then PP has correctly stated the conflict. Unions generally owe their support to actives and don’t represent retirees.
Sure. I was merely pointing out it’s not a choice between paying pensioners and paying union employees. Illinois has shown us that they prefer the third choice of raising taxes.
I didn’t say legislate. I said emergency decree. As the crisis unfolds Pritzker will be forced to realize that his status quo is unsustainable, that no bailout is coming from Washington and that Illinois can’t print money. Triage or default will be the only choice he has. My “dream” is bankruptcy of course but that’s not currently available to the state. Taxing the rich is DOA.
You may be right about legislation BUT Springfield can’t repeal economic reality or amend the law of gravity. The trajectory is down. Fall precedes winter.
You won’t be able to decree an emergency and not pay pensions either. The economic reality is that more taxes will be raised and or spending will be cut. History has shown us that Illinois won’t cut spending so more taxes it is. FYI, there is no crisis. Illinois is currently paying around 11 billion towards state pensions and brings in over 50 billion in revenue. Those payments will rise to over 18 billion by 2045 at which point those funds will be 90% funded. By 2046, the pension payment will drop to less than $4 billion. That means as… Read more »
Time for a reminder about what Dems and Republicans alike once said about that. When passing the pension reform that courts invalidated, the legislature expressly found that “the fiscal problems facing the state and its retirement systems cannot be solved without making some changes to the structure of the retirement systems.” And Dem A.G. Lisa Madigan argued in court that the crisis was so severe as to activate legislative police power. They argued: Raising taxes instead of making the pension cuts under SB-1 wasn’t a workable alternative, they told the courts. Doing so would reduce economic activity in Illinois by… Read more »
Yes. They cried that it was their only choice and the courts didn’t buy it. Since then they have been making payments towards those state pensions and the state is collecting more money than ever and the amount going towards pensions as a percentage has dropped.
It’s also time for a reminder that both republicans and democrats recently voted to enhance some tier 2 pension members to the more costly tier 1 status. Hard to claim a “crisis” when we are still making pensions even costlier.
In all my years on this earth, I’ve read countless comments on the internet, and few have ever struck me as more arrogant than those from this PPF fellow.
Technically, you could never completely stop COLA because members contribute 0.5% of their salary for annual annuity increases. At minimum, they are entitled to 1.5% simple COLA, which was the agreed-upon rate when COLAs were first enacted 50+ years ago.
I think emergency decree could override other laws. Pritzker stopped landlords from evicting tenants. He closed churches notwithstanding right to worship. One could argue about what’s an emergency but I wonder if a court could invalidate emergency decree that governor has authority to issue.
You would be wrong. The state tried that argument the last time and The Illinois Supreme Court smacked it down.
“Crisis is not an excuse to abandon the rule of law.”
“The pension protection clause contains no exception, restriction or limitation for an exercise of the State’s police powers or reserved sovereign powers.”
“The General Assembly may find itself in crisis, but it is a crisis which other public pension systems managed to avoid and, as reflected in the SEC order, it is a crisis for which the General Assembly itself is largely responsible”
Keep dreaming.
PPF
5 months ago
Good news! All five systems beat their expected returns. The debt is expected to increase to $146 billion in 2026 and then gradually decline so that by 2045 they will be 90% funded. Just need to keep paying the bills on time. Paying your bills will keep you out of debt. What a concept.
Oh yes, swell. And the projected budget deficit is expected to grow $22 billion in ten years.https://datawrapper.dwcdn.net/dJQPB/1/ That’s thanks largely to ever growing state pension contributions, which are eating our lunch and assuring that the state does not regain competitiveness.
It takes a massive need to believe pensions can and will be paid to buy into the alternate reality that pensions can be 90% funded by 2045.
The main obstacles to this pipe dream are the currently working public union members.
Last edited 5 months ago by ProzacPlease
Leaving Soon, just not soon enough
5 months ago
The Briefing should be called “Dire Straits”, there is little hope this will ever get solved. Taxes are far too high now and need to be double just to keep the pensions above water. The only way out now for the taxpayer is to get out of state.
A largely unasked question is becoming glaring: Is Illinois doing all it should to use artificial intelligence to make government cost less and work better? So far, the evidence says no.
I continue to read with interest all the different viewpoints on a very serious topic. i have made my decision that the taxes will continue and for my situation I have now embarked on this path.I am in the process of closing my business, A corporation that has been open for 38 years. The employees are now gone, office closing, waiting for filling of final tax docs. it does not pay as this state does not care what happens to businesses. I am done paying excessive taxes, FUTA and regulations taxes. I am closing corporate bank and checking accounts opening… Read more »
Very sorry to hear that, though I can’t blame you.
Best decision you have ever made for yourself and your family. Tens of thousands of people are head of you and even more will follow you. Best of luck.
Illinois need to place a 10% service charge on all pensions paid to people not living in Illinois.
Would not fly, legally.
Gee, we haven’t seen that no-go proposal for maybe 3-4 days. You are not a frequent reader here apparently. “Service charges” will be considered the same in their effect as taxes and given that name essentially as a ruse for it no matter whether applied to all IL public employee pensioners or selective subsets, clearly are not allowable by the “pension clause” of the 1970 IL constitution. Now, if you clearly intend it to apply to literally every IL pensioner you may have a winning strategy, although that service charge you want is still a tax by another name.
Once someone moves out of state you can’t tax their pensions regardless if it’s public or private. David’s illegal solution that he post here every couple of days would violate federal law. His low intellect plays well with many here but offers no real world solution.
Thanks. I had forgotten that prohibition.
Legislate with teeth to stop COLA until a system is 90% funded and freeze salaries until pension contributions equal 25% of payroll. Pritzker suspended numerous contractual provisions during COVID via emergency decrees. Rating agencies and creditors should insist on something like this as conditions for marketable ratings or future loans or refraining from default and collection efforts. Object: force municipal bankruptcies.
Nope. You can’t legislate away the states debt. Your only choice is to pay. Keep dreaming.
Good luck explaining that to the current public union workers who expect to be treated like their forebears collecting inflated pensions based on ridiculous salaries.
Do you want to explain that they can’t have increases because the money must be used to pay retirees? I’m sure they will understand.
That’s adorable that you think future spending fights will be between current unions employees and retirees. I’m sure in order to pay pensions Illinois will cut spending for union employees. lol. Seriously, you should be writing comedy.
Maybe they can find enough money by cutting down on office supplies, right? And looking between the couch cushions in every government office.
You seem to be saying that both actives and retirees will have all of their expectations met. But maybe you are saying that if funds are insufficient then pensions must be paid first. If it’s the latter, then PP has correctly stated the conflict. Unions generally owe their support to actives and don’t represent retirees.
Please clarify.
Sure. I was merely pointing out it’s not a choice between paying pensioners and paying union employees. Illinois has shown us that they prefer the third choice of raising taxes.
I didn’t say legislate. I said emergency decree. As the crisis unfolds Pritzker will be forced to realize that his status quo is unsustainable, that no bailout is coming from Washington and that Illinois can’t print money. Triage or default will be the only choice he has. My “dream” is bankruptcy of course but that’s not currently available to the state. Taxing the rich is DOA.
You may be right about legislation BUT Springfield can’t repeal economic reality or amend the law of gravity. The trajectory is down. Fall precedes winter.
You won’t be able to decree an emergency and not pay pensions either. The economic reality is that more taxes will be raised and or spending will be cut. History has shown us that Illinois won’t cut spending so more taxes it is. FYI, there is no crisis. Illinois is currently paying around 11 billion towards state pensions and brings in over 50 billion in revenue. Those payments will rise to over 18 billion by 2045 at which point those funds will be 90% funded. By 2046, the pension payment will drop to less than $4 billion. That means as… Read more »
Time for a reminder about what Dems and Republicans alike once said about that. When passing the pension reform that courts invalidated, the legislature expressly found that “the fiscal problems facing the state and its retirement systems cannot be solved without making some changes to the structure of the retirement systems.” And Dem A.G. Lisa Madigan argued in court that the crisis was so severe as to activate legislative police power. They argued: Raising taxes instead of making the pension cuts under SB-1 wasn’t a workable alternative, they told the courts. Doing so would reduce economic activity in Illinois by… Read more »
Yes. They cried that it was their only choice and the courts didn’t buy it. Since then they have been making payments towards those state pensions and the state is collecting more money than ever and the amount going towards pensions as a percentage has dropped.
It’s also time for a reminder that both republicans and democrats recently voted to enhance some tier 2 pension members to the more costly tier 1 status. Hard to claim a “crisis” when we are still making pensions even costlier.
Another installment in that ongoing saga- Public Employees Battle Reality and Emerge Victorious- narrated by the unreliable narrator PPF.
In all my years on this earth, I’ve read countless comments on the internet, and few have ever struck me as more arrogant than those from this PPF fellow.
Technically, you could never completely stop COLA because members contribute 0.5% of their salary for annual annuity increases. At minimum, they are entitled to 1.5% simple COLA, which was the agreed-upon rate when COLAs were first enacted 50+ years ago.
I think emergency decree could override other laws. Pritzker stopped landlords from evicting tenants. He closed churches notwithstanding right to worship. One could argue about what’s an emergency but I wonder if a court could invalidate emergency decree that governor has authority to issue.
You would be wrong. The state tried that argument the last time and The Illinois Supreme Court smacked it down.
Keep dreaming.
Good news! All five systems beat their expected returns. The debt is expected to increase to $146 billion in 2026 and then gradually decline so that by 2045 they will be 90% funded. Just need to keep paying the bills on time. Paying your bills will keep you out of debt. What a concept.
Oh yes, swell. And the projected budget deficit is expected to grow $22 billion in ten years.https://datawrapper.dwcdn.net/dJQPB/1/ That’s thanks largely to ever growing state pension contributions, which are eating our lunch and assuring that the state does not regain competitiveness.
It takes a massive need to believe pensions can and will be paid to buy into the alternate reality that pensions can be 90% funded by 2045.
The main obstacles to this pipe dream are the currently working public union members.
The Briefing should be called “Dire Straits”, there is little hope this will ever get solved. Taxes are far too high now and need to be double just to keep the pensions above water. The only way out now for the taxpayer is to get out of state.