Ted joined Dan and Amy to talk about the potential payroll tax and mileage tax being considered in Springfield, why Illinois’ property tax system is so messed up, the latest on the lawsuit regarding Bally’s public offering, the good news of Texas passing universal school choice, and more.
Read more from Wirepoints:
- Illinois increasingly surrounded by school choice states. Gov. Abbott signs universal school choice into Texas law.
- The Real Scandal in Bally’s Chicago Deal: Exploiting Minorities While Pretending to Help
- West Coast gas prices for Rust Belt Illinoisans.
- 2024 data: Not a single child tested proficient in math in 80 Illinois schools. For reading, it was 24 schools.
- Illinois isn’t building homes. Housing stock is up less than 1% vs. 2020, nation’s 2nd-worst performance.
- Illinois metro areas take the top four spots for nation’s highest property taxes. Rockford takes the crown.
Audio and summary 
If this bill passes, say goodbye to local control over all Illinois parks and expect to see open drug and alcohol use, needles, no sanitation and fire hazards, but no ordinary park users.
Expect no retraction or apology. This what they do.
When I bought my first home in the Montclare neighborhood in 1988, I paid $114K & taxes were under $3K. I sold in 1998 for 163.5K, and taxes were $4K. They are now about $9K. I moved to Grayslake, paid $176K, taxes at $4K. I left in 2021, home sold for $297K, about $17K more than homes were selling for in 2005. The taxes were $9100. They doubled. Like all RE taxes, 70% went to the school district. The myth that teachers are underpaid is just that, myth. They are making good money, on par with what the private sector… Read more »
Most people are irate about the latest property tax bills we just received. Everyone is complaining on Facebook posts and are wondering why.
Freddy, it is a shame. I loved Chicago, my neighborhood where I grew up & the surrounding area. I’m so pissed that I had to move because of incompetent & corrupt leaders & the stupid people that keep electing them.
Lived in central illinois for 5 decades. We moved out of illinois 6 years ago. Same price for the houses in both states. illinois property tax was $ 4200 but my new house is only $870. There is absolutely no fixing illinois. Get out if you still can. illinois is a waste of life. Oh yea our schools spend half of what illinois spends per student and the students can actually read and do math at grade level. What have you got to lose??
Interesting headline. Are the poor really the poorest if they own a home? The poor I know seem to live in section 8 housing and are not homeowners.
Once again, Illinois could effect major reductions in PTs, but the taxpayers wouldn’t benefit. That’s because Illinois would make up for the lost revenue by creating and/or raising taxes and fees elsewhere. Mismanagement machines need a lot of tax and fee revenue. The more mismanagement is in place, the more tax and fee revenue it needs. Let’s see, where does Illinois rank among mismanaged states?
And for the last ten years it is no longer just a Chicago or Cook County issue. It is statewide, City, suburbs and downstate. It is a lethal issue for JB’s national ambitions.
At this rate I’m about to join em. Old Joe went from living in his own house to the poor house…..
“Property taxes are perfectly legal when they are applied to the entities they were written for. Pennsylvania comes right out and states in Title 61, Sections 153.1 and 155.1, here is their definition of taxpayer. It’s an entity, organized AND incorporated under the statutes, AND doing business in the state, or owning property in the state, or conducting activities in the state. That’s what a taxpayer is. And within that code they will list 11 or 12 separate legal entities, they will break up the individual taxpayer entities. If anyone wants to look this up in your state, you’ve got… Read more »
When the government confiscates your home for not paying property taxes make sure you tell them that it’s unconstitutional. I’m sure that will stop them in their tracks. After you lose your home maybe you can hang out with the same sovereign citizens that promote this garbage and commiserate about how the government is wrong.
You’re lost. I never recommended not paying, but take your property tax case to the assessor. Faggiolo has been paying his property taxes during the whole court case.
https://www.kiplinger.com/taxes/will-florida-property-tax-be-eliminated
Property taxes will always be unfair as they don’t do a good job of determining ones ability to pay. Illinois would need to shift away from property taxes and increase income taxes to alleviate this problem where the poor get hurt the most. So who here wants income taxes to increase? or start taxing services? or perhaps taxing retirement income? maybe even a progressive income tax? We don’t want the burden to fall on the poor after all. If voters in Illinois want property taxes to be reduced they will need to get on board with additional funding elsewhere or… Read more »
“…or ouline where the State can cut expenditures.”
Cut 1% from the budgets of each one of these 94 (!) State governmental departments, Boards and Commissions.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Illinois_state_agencies
Cutting 1% from the entire $53 billion dollar budget would only result in $530 million in savings. You couldn’t cut 1% from the debt payments anyway. About $3.8 billion is directed towards paying back bonds. About $10-11 billion is directed towards pensions. So if you cut 1% of the rest of the budget you are looking at around $390 million in savings. Of course, that amount directed at pensions isn’t enough based on actuarial assumptions so a truly balanced budget would require about $5 billion more going to pensions. All of this means that even if you cut the rest… Read more »
To pay for huge pensions taxes must go up, up and away for as far as the eye can see. This will continue on for generations to come. The numbers are so out of line it will never get paid. What you are going to see is higher taxes and still even higher pension debt which will cause more people to flee the state at an even higher rate than now.
They could cut spending and stop new funding programs for whatever is the “most vulnerable in need of funding” group of the day for a change. A good place to start would be in the elimination of expanded Medicaid that Quinn was so happy to sign us all up for. Simple common sense dictates you can’t afford new programs when you can’t pay for the old but that’s not how it works in the minds of Illinois voters.
There is another way: pension reform constitutionally. Eliminate them for new hires going forward, eliminate cola, cut all pensions by 25% effective immediately.
You could eliminate them for new hires but currently tier 2 is paying more than their benefits pay out. They are subsidizing the system.
You can’t cut ALL pension by 25% effective immediately. You can’t eliminate COLAs or annual annuity increases of 3%. Those moves would violate the constitution. You must be new to this topic Peter.
Peter is yet one more guy who has pipe-dream proposals ignoring the harsh complexity when reality intrudes.
PPF, please provide proof or examples when you state “currently tier 2 is paying more than their benefits pay out.”?
I don’t have a link handy but that is true. Has been for some time.
is that for JUST Tier 2 that make it to being vested (10 yrs?)? or all current Tier 2 the vast majority of whom don’t last long enough to be vested?
It’s true even for those who vest. Even the former head of TRS used to complain about it.
Here is one example from The Civic Federation.
https://www.civicfed.org/iifs/blog/proposed-tier-2-pension-changes-raise-questions-about-long-term-costs?utm_source=chatgpt.com
Illinois Policy also stated back in 2020 that it appears that Tier 2 pensioners are actually subsidizing Tier 1, at least for teachers.
So the problem is not that Tier 1 benefit cost is 21.6% of salary on 9% contribution (or 2% with pension pickup)? It’s that Tier 2 benefits are only 7.1%?
Would we not be entertained by a civil war between public union members?
There is no civil war. The money is owed by the state not by the other party. You are seeing tier 2 members demand better benefits. Will that entertain you? That’s all you’re going to get.
It may not be owed by the Tier 2 members, but it all goes in the same pot. Tier 1 dips their massive ladle in that pot first.
But maybe you are right and Tier 2 will never figure out where all the money they put in the pot actually goes. I’m sure Stacy Davis Gates will keep everyone in line.
That “pot” you refer to is the responsibility of the state not the tier 1 or tier 2 pensioners. There is nothing to figure out. If it runs low the state is responsible for payment. The ladle will just dip into state revenue.
There is one way to get more revenue without raising taxes and that is get rid of most welfare. People have been on welfare for generations. Find out who is truly needy like the disabled or veterans who fought for our country and made sacrifices for all of us. The benefits for them should be increased. Look around at the grocery store and ask the cashiers about what they see with link cards and you will get an ear full. They pass the cards to each other and most of it is junk food like soda and chips. One of… Read more »
The problem is if there are additional taxes raised from multiple sources what is the guarantee that it will lower property taxes. Look at all the promises made when the lottery first started. The money will go to schools which some of it did then the general fund paid less to schools. there is no guarantee the money will go to reduce property taxes. I don’t mind paying a little more in state taxes to reduce property taxes but it will be earmarked to somewhere else. Where is all the money going from the increased gas and plate fees going… Read more »
No one is charging tuition Freddy so you can forget about that. It won’t happen. The state is constitutionally required to provide an education and you won’t be able to charge tuition as some sort of cost savings without changing it. Good luck with that. You’re right that increasing taxes elsewhere won’t necessarily provide property tax relief. See my comment above as to why. The state needs more money if you want property tax relief. There is no way around this. That’s why no one will do anything about it. The politicians that try to fix it will only receive… Read more »
Yes the state is constitutionally required to provide an education. Well the state IS negligent in that requirement. Just look at the results in public schools here in Illinois and around the country. Kids can barely read-write-do math and are passed on and graduate so people who do not pay for the “Free” education are getting exactly what they are paying for which is Nothing. They are much much better off paying tuition and expect results.
Yes, I would trade property taxes for any/all of the taxes you indicated here. Property taxes are particularly onerous and make it so that you never really own the home you purchased.
100 percent agree Sand.
Actually Sand in Illinois you pay for your home 2 to 3 times if you stay in in long enough. Once to the bank and twice to the government.
End property taxes for retirees. Solves it right there.
The classic simple solution on the surface that doesn’t actually solve anything. Let’s say 15% of all property taxes are paid by those over the age of 65. That 15% reduction will now need to be assessed on the remaining property tax payers. So 15/85 is a 17.65% increase for those under the age of 65. Property taxes are setup so that if someone pays less, everyone else pays more. Your solution solves nothing but putting more tax pressure on the working people of Illinois while allowing retirees to not only avoid income taxes but now also avoid property taxes.… Read more »
Your concern that something would be popular with a particular voting bloc but awful for everyone else is really touching.
Then why do seniors get a special deduction or $5K in addition to the homeowners ded? Why is a certain group getting special treatment? Right now in Ptell counties (39) any type of deduction (all of them) or special tax abatements raises the tax rate for everyone else. So if seniors were to get a larger ded the tax rate would increase so that no taxing body will get less than the year before. This insures them that no belt/budget tightening in ever needed or discussed. No layoffs in down times just more raises and benefits year after year thanks… Read more »
So, you think that non-retirees won’t mind picking up the resulting tax deficit through their own resulting property tax increases? I’m betting they won’t appreciate your idea. Your idea likely is dead even at the starting gate.
Respectfully disagree in part. Not dead at all. We pay more and more every year. Property tax rates have gone down but taxes are up because of increase total values in part by very low inventory. Rockford has only 150 homes on the market. If you have read my post above very few people know about Ptell even if they live the counties under that jurisdiction. They may have voted for it like I did but the downside was never brought up even by the media. I don’t think people would have voted for it knowing the tax consequences. At… Read more »
Freddy, Why do you think it’s fair that retirees already get an income tax break and should also get a property tax break? Why should two retirees (maybe living off those fat pensions) earning 300k per year pay nothing in income taxes while two parents making 80k per year collectively should pay 4k in income taxes? As you’ve noted, you already get a break on your property taxes but that’s not enough for you. You want working age people to pay even more while well to do retirees pay nothing. If anything, retirees should start paying income taxes like everyone… Read more »
Here is some info on property tax deductions in Indiana which is much more fair than in Illinois. The system they have helps keep more seniors in their homes with larger deductions.
We just received out tax bills in Rockford and people are furious. Rockford is trying to answer questions from homeowners via Facebook which I will check out. Many are sick and tired of paying these ridiculous taxes. Let us all know why we should not get a break in taxes. It never ends with these insatiable taxing bodies.
https://legalclarity.org/indiana-homestead-deduction-eligibility-application-and-benefits/
Indiana collects income taxes on retirees for pension and 401k/IRA withdrawals. Pros and cons to every state. If you want property tax relief you will need to get on board with taxes elsewhere.
and don’t forget the assessment freeze many seniors get. I get a kick out of them when they say “we paid our way and now its turn for you to pay your way” when a lot of the problems are the hanging on programs that the seniors themselves voted for. We could add that these same seniors elected the politicians that did not fund the pensions effectively passing the buck to todays younger generations. Thinking about it…the seniors should pay more in taxes for the problems they have caused
That’s the funniest part RB. The same people that voted in elected leaders that have been kicking the can for decades now want a break. We have a massive housing crisis where the younger members of society can’t even hope to buy a house at the same rate as prior generations and the current retirees who get massive tax breaks already want even more.
I’m sympathetic to those that can’t afford to pay their property taxes but not the ones who aren’t willing to accept that other taxes will need to be raised.
Don’t forget those people voted in the assorted permit, zoning and other red tape laws that also helped make the cost of housing unaffordable too. What a shame
Can you list all the programs seniors voted for? Of course it’s now seniors that cause the problems. Of course nothing to do with the public sectors employees who bought and paid for the pols they voted for who give them anything they want. Deals are made behind closed doors. Who knows what they do back there. Most likely 3x’s stuff.
In my area we built new school buildings, referendums mind you, , sports complexes and those super duper streetscapes along with associated maintenance and administrative costs. My guess is every other area did the same. Then we have that expanded Medicaid and don’t forget Chicago has been a sanctuary city for quite some time incurring all sorts of costs for housing who knows who. I think thats enough right there for starters. Oh I did want to mention this nice new public safety building that coincidentally happened when our pension fund grades dropped a notch…funny how that happened…and then there… Read more »
It does not look like the voters have a choice on a ballot for Tifs but a joint review board does. Citizens can voice their concerns within a 45 day review in from of the board but it does not look like we can vote for or against them.Please correct me if I’m wrong. There are I believe 30 Tifs in Rockford and our taxes still go up a lot and only a few areas benefited a little. Now add in Ptell and people wonder why taxes are so high.
https://mahometdaily.com/top-10-things-you-need-to-know-about-tif-districts/
Oh and add the TIFs that the seniors, via the ballot box, voted for